CACTUS: out today the new Cactus album “Temple of Blues II” | interview with Carmine Appice

LLRR: Thank you for your time. I’m an Italian in the LA area and I write for the Italian webzine LLRR, and I don’t have to remind you how much you are loved in my former country.

CARMINE: Thank you. Yeah.

LLRR: In Italy, we call you in the Italian way, but I know that you want to be called “Appice” [pronounced App-is], right?

CARMINE: Well, I say “Appis”, but in Italy, it’s APPICE (with an Italian accent).

LLRR: The first question is: do you go to Italy for vacation and not only for work? I saw you there a couple of times with Vanilla Fudge. Do you go there just to relax and enjoy?

CARMINE: Um, I used to; I used to like to go to Italy. But unfortunately, the last time I was in Europe in 2018, I had a really bad health issue. Oh, and I almost didn’t get back. So, because of that, I don’t go to Europe or Japan or South America or anything like that. I just basically stay in the USA. Okay? Because, you know, the flights are too long. And God forbid something happens again, I don’t want to be stuck.

And last time I got stuck in the middle of nowhere in the Azores, you know, and I was there for three or four days. And then I went back to France and then I had to take a medical airlift back to New York. It was a nightmare. So I try not to do it again, but I love Italy. I was there with my brother. We did it on the last tour; we were doing “Drum Wars” and both of us were there. And I just saw a picture today, a flashback on my phone: it was me and Vinnie eating pizza in Italy, you know?

LLRR: Yeah. Okay. So, let’s talk about the record. Somebody told me it would be a blues, rock-blues record. Then I listened to the first track and it was a punch in the face. It was like, “We play serious rock and roll here,” really energetic. Is this how you define blues?

CARMINE: Well, define blues. Blues is the grandfather of rock and roll. That’s pretty much it. You know, rock and roll started with the I-IV-V changes. And that’s what blues was: the I-IV-V changes. And, you know, so it’s just a little more elementary, I guess you’d say, in the changes and some of the lyrics.

You know, if you listen to some of the lyrics on this record, they’re moaning. The only lyric is “Somebody’s calling me on my telephone. Somebody’s calling me on my telephone.” That’s pretty much the lyric, you know? But the melody and the way it’s played is great. Yeah. And this has a lot of energy. I would move them more into the rock area because it’s pretty powerful. It’s super nice. Yeah.

LLRR: I love the big guitars, and you do as well. We will talk about that later. And respecting all the job done by all the guests that you had, Eric Gales surprised me a lot. The first track and the solo are unbelievable. The feeling and everything were almost overwhelming. I loved it. Were you a big friend of his before?

CARMINE: Yeah. Especially with Eric Gales. Well, I knew Eric for a long time. I knew him when he was younger. I first met him when he did a Jimi Hendrix tribute back in the day. And then he had some problems with the law. And then he recently made a comeback in the last couple of years.

But I love him, man. He was always a great guy. I think Jimi Hendrix lives in him. The way he plays upside down, left-handed, the way he sings—all that is like Jimi Hendrix. So I don’t know what made me think about Eric. I think I might have got an email from him seeing how I’m doing. Like that kind of email, text or something. And I said, “Wow, he’d be great for this record.” It’s one of those deals. And since then, he’s been doing very well. He had a song on the soundtrack of the movie Sinners, he played on the Oscars the other day, and he’s doing very well. I’m glad to have him on this because he did a tremendous job.

LLRR: Yes, yes. The solo is unbelievable, really. When listening to the record I had so much fun, and even the neighborhood too, because the volume was so loud. The kind of fun like: “Let’s go racing in the desert and life is good.” I can feel you guys had fun during the recording.

CARMINE: We had fun. We definitely had fun. Because you never know what’s going to happen. Once you give the tape to somebody like Eric… I gave him the tape. I had a part one and a part two. Part two was an up-tempo fast part, which I wanted him to really blast off and kick ass.

So, when he sent it back to me, he didn’t play on it. I said, “Why didn’t you play?” He said, “Because I thought that was for the drums.” I said, “No, that was for you to blast off, to really kick ass!” And I sent it back to him. He did really kick ass then. So, you never know what’s going to happen with everybody. People do different things. They sing something differently. They play something differently. So, when I get something back, it’s always different than what I expect.

LLRR: Another thing that surprised me is that you have so many guests that have, of course, different styles, different signatures, and personalities, etc., but the record sounds like it’s just one band; it’s glued together. The question is: you have a thousand guests, but how do you make it feel like only one band is playing?

CARMINE: Well, I mean, the basic demo was done by me. I start with the drums and I get the feel on the drums because the drums are the whole feel of everything. If you had different drummers on each track, it would feel different. But because every song’s feel comes from the drums, right? And the song starts with me and a click.

Then I would take whatever the tempo of the click is and I put a voice of mine playing the riff. You know, if I was doing like “Evil”, I would go… [mimics riff]… “Long way from home.” I do the whole song like that. And some of the songs like “Molen”, I did that. And I said, “You know what? I got an old bass here. Let me plug it in.” I plugged it in and I played bass on it. And then I put drums on it. And then I sent it to Artie, my guitar player, and he puts guitar on it. And then we sent it to our singer. And so, then we have a demo. That’s why they all sound similar.

Then whoever the guest is puts his stuff on the demo and takes off. If it’s like Eric, he kept the rhythm guitar on, but he took off the lead guitar and took off the vocal. And then he played to that. So that’s why it sounds like the same band, because it started with the same demo.

LLRR: Yeah, absolutely. And talking about all the guests, was it easy for you to have them disciplined to follow your guidelines and follow your project? You know, you are an authority. With so many names and so many personalities, how did you keep them together doing the right thing without doing too much on their own?

CARMINE: Well, you know, if it was like I did with Eric, if it wasn’t what I wanted [I’d tell them]. But I didn’t have that problem often. I did have one problem with Rudy Sarzo before he played in the groove of “Tail Dragger”. I played in the groove, but I said, “Man, you could do more than that.” He said, “Well, let’s wait till we get the guitar on.” So, we got Alex Skolnick on and that gave Rudy more room to move around with the guitar, you know, but still keeping my drums in there to hold it all together.

LLRR: And I have a question for a guy I personally love. I love him, but I know he has a huge personality. How were you able to keep Ted Nugent on track? Because he’s an impulsive guy.

CARMINE: To get who? Ted Nugent? Well, Ted’s an old friend of mine. You know, he loved Cactus. He loved Cactus. That was one of his favorite bands. And we’re doing a gig April 3rd in the Chicago area. I had Ted do a little advertisement for me. And he said, “If you haven’t heard Cactus, you’re missing out on the best rock and roll band there ever was.” You know, he loved Cactus. So anytime I say, “Hey, look, I want to do something with a Cactus album I’d love for you to play on,” he goes, “I’m there.”

And he loves me. I’ve known him since 1967. And he considers me one of the top rock drummers, if not the top rock drummer, in his mind. So, he always says, “I’ll do something for you.” He would have played on the gig with us, but he’s busy and he booked himself doing other stuff, you know.

LLRR: And another thing… the version of “Purple Haze”, I think it’s a masterpiece. You know, it’s a tribute, but it’s done your way. Can you tell me a little more about your relationship with Melanie and how it was recording this song with her?

CARMINE: Well, “Purple Haze” was interesting because my record label, Cleopatra… when she passed away, the owner worked with the estate and worked out a deal with them that he could use her voice on new recordings or old recordings, you know, basically use her voice.

So, he called me and said, “Look, I would love to do a song with Cactus and Melanie.” I said, “Melanie? The ‘Roller Skate’ song person?” He said, “Yes.” I was a little taken back. I had to hear it. So, he sent me the voice alone, just alone. And I said, “That’s Melanie?” She sounds like Janis Joplin sometimes! The scream and all that was great.

So, I said, “Yeah, yeah, we can do something. That’s ‘Purple Haze’. We could definitely do something with that.” So, then we stretched her out, put her on a click, and then I put the drums on first to get the foundation of what the thing’s going to feel like and the arrangement. I played in time. And then when the solo came, I went up-tempo for 16 bars and back to the song. And I just followed what we had on her voice.

And I talked to my engineer. He did some edits. I said, “Okay, we’re going to do a solo here. So that’d be 16 bars, up-tempo solo. Then we’ll come back down to the verse.” So, we did that kind of edit. And we just followed between the drums and the voice. We came up with the arrangement. And then I gave it to my guitar player again. My bass player was out of town, but my guitar player, Artie Dillon, played guitar and bass on it initially. And then we gave it to Tony Franklin, and then he put the [final] bass on it. So, none of this stuff was done in one room. Everybody was in their own studios. Not one thing was done together in one room. But you’d never know it. It sounds like we’re all playing together.

LLRR: Absolutely. And a question about another guest: Dee Snider is back in the album, right? But he will not go on tour now because of problems that he had. Can you assure us that he’s okay?

CARMINE: Yeah, well, he’s okay. But he’s not supposed to be singing because when he sings, he puts so much energy and everything into it. It’s something going on with his health. I don’t really know why, but that’s what he said in the press release.

And I wanted him to play on the show that we’re doing. Initially, he promised he would do it. Then he said he can’t do it. And I asked him to be the master of ceremonies. He said he didn’t want to MC, you know, introduce everybody, because then everybody keeps asking him, “What’s wrong with you?” and he doesn’t want to keep telling everybody that.

And I think we might have gotten the last new recorded performance of Dee Snider on this record, you know, because it doesn’t look like he’s going to be singing any… or maybe I mean, he might be able to do some recording, you know. Yeah, I wish him the best. I love Dee. He’s a good guy. He sang on the last record, “Evil”. He did “Evil” with a group called Widowmaker years ago. And, you know, he’s from Long Island. I’m from Long Island and Brooklyn. We’ve known each other a long time. Kind of like Ted.

LLRR: Please let him know that in Italy, they love him as well. We love him a lot.

CARMINE: Yeah, I know. Everybody loves him. He’s a good guy. He’s the face of Twisted Sister. So I’m surprised they’re going to get who they’re getting—Sebastian Bach is going to sing. But I mean, that’s like a whole different ballgame. His vocals, they don’t sound like Dee at all. And my singer has a rusty voice, so he’s singing the Dee songs. And he can do it because he has that kind of voice. But I don’t know… maybe Sebastian Bach can do that. I always thought his voice was a little sweeter. We’ll see. We’ll see. I’m curious. Yeah.

LLRR: And now, outside of the album, I am sure you love the “big guitars,” right? Because I have Guitar Zeus, the record that you did with all those guitar players. And you put people together that I never thought about, like Doug Pinnick and Yngwie Malmsteen in the same room. Was it funny?

CARMINE: They weren’t in the same room. It’s the same thing: it was in different studios but done at different times. But we did have the record tracks done in the same studio with me and Kelly Keeling playing rhythm guitar and Tony Franklin. They were done all together. But then we overdubbed all the guitar players in different places.

So, we did Doug Pinnick first, and Yngwie loved Doug Pinnick and always wanted to work with him. Okay? And having Yngwie on it was… it’s just Guitar Zeus we’re talking about. Having Yngwie on it made it really interesting. Like the two people, you know, just like on the new album, Rudy and Alex Skolnick is a weird combination and I like doing that. And like Melanie and Cactus is a weird combination, but it makes stuff interesting, you know.

LLRR: And again, in Guitar Zeus, it sounds like the same band, not so many different people.

CARMINE: Yeah, it is the same band. And now, it actually is the same band also, because on Guitar Zeus, we used a core band of me, Tony Franklin, and Kelly Keeling. And the only other bass player we used on that record is Bob Daisley. That’s the only one. But everybody else was the band. And maybe as we got going, we did Guitar Zeus Japan and Guitar Zeus Korea, and Kelly Keeling played some fretless bass on some things, you know. But basically, I’d say 95% of the songs were just a core band of me, Tony Franklin, and Kelly Keeling on rhythm guitar.

LLRR: Yeah, makes sense. Now your instrument, the drums. Of course, you are an icon worldwide with this unbelievable balance between power and technique. You’re an example for both seasoned musicians and new kids on the block. You’re good for anyone. You had some educational material that was pretty successful. So do you like teaching, you know, showing your style, exposing yourself to unknown people? Can you tell me something about this teaching side of you?

CARMINE: My teaching? Education was a big part of my career. Not anymore, because now, I mean, I still do a few masterclasses here and there, but it used to be when you get a drum deal, they say, “Okay, we’ll give you the drums, we’ll do this, we’ll do that, and we’ll give you 30 clinics a year.” And with that, they do 30 clinics all over the world. I’ve done clinics everywhere, you know.

And then I wrote a book in 1971. And the book became a big seller, and it became the kind of book where other drummers that are now famous went through the book when they were younger. And now we’re re-releasing the book again. And we got all these different people endorsing the book, like Kenny Aronoff, Greg Bissonette, Dave Weckl, Chad Smith, and just so many people… Ian Paice… because these are the guys that I influenced and the book influenced. So, you know, so that became a whole part of my career, the educational part.

I wrote a series of other books, too. And I did the clinics. I was like, really into education. And I even did a thing called “Little Kids Rock”, where I went to schools and I taught these young kids how to play to keep them off the streets in bad areas, where they would normally be with gangs and stuff, you know. So, I loved to teach.

Now I started getting back into it like… we’re going on the road with some Vanilla Fudge shows. And the last gig, my merch girl has become my booker for master classes. I did one in Seattle last year. I did one this year in South Carolina. I’m doing another one in upstate New York at the end of this month, the end of April. So we’re getting back into it because she wants to book it, and we will sell merch. She does the merch, and we sell a lot of merchandise, you know—t-shirts and books and sticks and drumheads.

LLRR: And now let me say, between you and your brother, totally different styles, both everywhere with the most important musicians in the world. Now my question is: is it too much talent for just the same family? Do you think it’s too much talent for just two brothers?

CARMINE: We have, on my father’s side of the family, seven drummers. Okay? I was number two. Vinnie, I think, was about number five, and my son played drums too. He doesn’t do it for a living; he just bangs on his car dashboard. But when me and Vinnie were practicing for “Drum Wars”, we went down to the kitchen to get something. All of a sudden, we hear the drums playing, and I said, “Vinnie, who came in? Did somebody come in?” And we go upstairs. My son was playing. I got him a little drum set when he was a kid, four or five years old. He was about 20 years old at the time. And I said, “Wow, it must be the Appice blood.” Whatever the name is pronounced, it must be in the blood, you know?

LLRR: And now a question, because one of my dreams is to have those two vinyls signed by you (showing two original Beck, Bogert & Appice records).

CARMINE: Wait, what’s the second one?

LLRR: The second is the live version.

CARMINE: Oh, yeah. Well, there’s a box set now.

LLRR: Can you tell us something about that period with Bogert and Jeff Beck?

CARMINE: Well, I think BBA was a long time coming. You know, Cactus was supposed to be BBA with Rod Stewart singing. That didn’t work out. Then we started Cactus, and then he started his band. That didn’t work out. He started another band and that didn’t work out. Then he asked me and Tim to join him.

But originally it was John Bonham that gave me Jeff Beck’s phone number to call Jeff because Jeff wanted to play with me and Tim. So, it went on for a while and then we finally did it. And it only lasted two years because, you know, Jeff was strange to work with. He was the best guitar player—he was the best—but, you know, we’d be on a sold-out tour everywhere, and we get up in Atlanta to eat breakfast, and I say to the tour manager, “What time is the sound check?” He said, “There is no sound check.” I said, “Why?” “Jeff Beck went home.” In the middle of the tour, he went home!

So that created a bit of a weird atmosphere for me and Tim. And the last show we recorded in London, Rainbow, that’s part of the box set… Tim was real sick and Jeff Beck was saying something to him, and Tim punched Jeff in the face. And that was the end of it.

But we did capture on that BBA London Live and the BBA in Japan… we really captured the essence of the band and the energy that all three of us had, which was amazing, you know. And that was a lot of fun. After that, I went on with Jeff to do Blow by Blow, but I didn’t end up on the album, even though I recorded five or six songs. There was a mix-up with the label and the manager wanting it to be just a Jeff Beck album—no Jeff Beck Group, no BBA, no Jeff Beck featuring Carmine, just Jeff Beck. So I couldn’t do it.

And I was really upset that I couldn’t do it because I really loved doing it. And it came out and sold really well. But then I realized, if I was with Jeff at that point in time, I wouldn’t have joined Rod. And for me, playing with Rod Stewart reinvented me as an artist, as a drummer, as an image, as everything.

LLRR: Okay. I have only a couple of more questions. You didn’t have such a good relationship with Sharon Osbourne, right? Were you able to talk to Ozzy before he went definitely to the UK?

CARMINE: I haven’t talked to Ozzy since probably the 1990s and haven’t talked to her since 1984. And Ozzy was a good guy. Even though she fired me, he knew that it wasn’t him. He said, “I know you have trouble with my missus, but I hope we could be friends.” I said, “Oz, I know it ain’t you.”

So when I was putting King Cobra together, I was painting our motorhome we had. I had to put tape and brown paper on the windows. Ozzy saw me—he was auditioning drummers at this rehearsal place I was doing this at—and he said, “What are you doing?” I told him, and he said, “Do you need any help?” I said, “Sure.” So I put him up on a little scaffold, and me and him were putting up tape on the windows. He was a good guy. I loved Ozzy.

I spent time with him in New York when me and him finished the Bark at the Moon album. I did vocals with him. We fixed the drum sound. We mixed it. And we took the SST to London. And we did the video. And we did the European tour. And I spent a lot of good time with Ozzy. I was really disappointed to get fired because I was planning to work with him and give him my killer drum sounds and my experience in songwriting. I just got over, a couple of years before that, “Do You Think I’m Sexy” being number one everywhere and “Young Turks” being number three everywhere. I could have done something with him to help his songwriting. Not that he needed it—he did some great songs—but it would have been great for me and him to work together. But it didn’t happen.

LLRR: What is the last record that you listened to? What is the last music you liked?

CARMINE: Papa Roach. I went to see them a few months ago with my friend and his kids. They were with a group called Shinedown, which I had never heard of. And when I went, Papa Roach opened up and they were awesome. I bought 10 songs on iTunes of theirs after that. I don’t belong to Spotify or anything like that because they rip us off so bad. I refuse to belong to that. But I actually went on iTunes and I bought 10 songs for a dollar each. So they made some money on it.

I did an interview with a company called Metal Shop recently. I was listening to my interview, and in between, they played other stuff and they played the new Papa Roach. And it was great. I’m going to go back on it and find out what the name of the track was so I can buy it. Because I like them. I really like them.

LLRR: I will take a look today. I’m curious right now. Do you have anything to ask your Italian fans? I will let you know what they reply.

CARMINE: I would love to come back. I love Italy. I love the pizza. I love the gnocchi. I love the pesto sauce. I love the eggplant parmesan… and it seems to be better over there. And I love the beautiful Italian women. I love seeing the Colosseum. I love seeing all the Roman ruins all over Europe. It shows what an amazing, amazing country Italy was. And I miss not going there. I really do. And I’m a Paisà. Come on!

LLRR: Yeah. So, thank you. It was an honor for me, really. Thank you for your music.

CARMINE: I will. And I’m going to keep playing and doing this stuff until I can’t do it no more. So, we have a lot more music in me.

LLRR: Oh, yeah. Oh, by the way, when will you record the next album? Next year?

CARMINE: I don’t know. Maybe start it next year and be out the year after. These kinds of records always take six months to do. I mean, I did a lot in my studio. I did King Cobra. I did two solo records—I don’t even know if you heard them—they’re called Appice Perdomo Project. You should check it out. Instrumental stuff. I had Billy Sheehan and Bumblefoot on it, and Derek Sherinian on it.

It’s instrumental. It’s really cool. It’s not like jazz-rock; it’s like rock-jazz. The rock is more present than the jazz is. But check it out. It’s on YouTube. There’s a song called “Drum City”. You should check it out because I do artwork, and the artwork was cities and different things. I did Stonehenge. I did the Leaning Tower of Pisa. The Leaning Tower of Pisa is made of drums! And I did the Pyramids. I did Brooklyn.

On the video, we took my drawings and made them the background. And we animated some of the stuff—I had little cars and they were animated. And it’s called “Drum City”. Check it out. Carmine Appice, “Drum City”. You’ll like it. It’s really kick-ass rock and roll.

LLRR: Okay. I will. Absolutely. Thank you again.

CARMINE: Thank you, brother. Bye-bye. Bye-bye. Ciao. Bye-bye.